Conversation

Notices

1. Hollyjollytailspike (monsterislandcolonizer@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:06:38 JST Hollyjollytailspike

   • d
   @deprecated_ii Also his math doesn't add up
   35 an hour for 5 12s is not 70k
   A lot of welders do make shit pay though
   • d (deprecated_ii@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:06:38 JST d

     in reply to
     @monsterislandcolonizer median pay for welders is like $50k
     
     in the trades, electricians are doing the best AFAIK. 6 year apprenticeship though
     Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks likes this.
   • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks (washedoutgundampilot@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:08:25 JST Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks

     in reply to

     • d

     @monsterislandcolonizer @deprecated_ii There's a whole lot of crap jobs out there nobody wants to admit to. I talked to a guy a while back who acted like he was rolling in it flying for this charter operator. If you ask him he never wants to move up to a carrier, as if he's making a couple hundred thousand a year. No numbers, of course, but pretending about the lifestyle.

     As soon as we get in private the old guy I'm working with is like "yeah he's probably full of shit, their FO pay is about 49,000 base last I heard

   • Hollyjollytailspike (monsterislandcolonizer@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:08:26 JST Hollyjollytailspike

     in reply to

     • d
     @deprecated_ii I guess I'm thinking of my experience in industrial work in particular, I've worked at mom and pop shops though and the difference in wages between that and a company building a power plant are enormous.
   • Hollyjollytailspike (monsterislandcolonizer@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:33:07 JST Hollyjollytailspike

     in reply to

     • d
     • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks
     @WashedOutGundamPilot @deprecated_ii Maybe so
     My base working on a big job was only $20 an hour (you can extrapolate that to annual salary)
     BUT
     I was also making $380 a week in per diem so at the end of the year I cleared like $65k instead of $41k.
     
     When I worked for a mom and pop shop I was making $12 an hour with no per diem 😅 and that wasn't exactly good money
   • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks (washedoutgundampilot@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:33:07 JST Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks

     in reply to

     • d

     @monsterislandcolonizer @deprecated_ii Don't even bring that up with our guys, most acrimonious arguments about jobs I've ever seen comes from the bushy tails talking up per diem like it's rad. Guys don't like seeing it taken as bonus pay when it's in the contract. I never got why they cared.

   • givenup (givenup@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 07:34:49 JST givenup

     in reply to

     • d
     • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks
     @WashedOutGundamPilot @monsterislandcolonizer @deprecated_ii i got the best job in the world, growing these pumpkin vines and taking care of chickens, and makeing home made handcraft soap.
     Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks likes this.
   • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks (washedoutgundampilot@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 08:41:06 JST Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks

     in reply to

     • d
     • Ame

     @AmericanChampion @monsterislandcolonizer @deprecated_ii Feast or famine, the majors have closed off hiring anyways so guys are stuck. Ever since they changed the rules in 09 we have to get 1500 hours total in order to get the airline jobs - that's where solid pay and vacation is, you can kinda have a family there.

     Most other stuff is basically where the fuckups go. Being a 45 yo at a charter op says that you're not likable enough to be hired elsewhere, unless you're one of the guys getting captain pay and enjoying being top of the seniority charts.

     All the smaller operators know they can underpay us because they're "paying you in flight time!". Until you get to something worth keeping for life (which for even the 'good' charters and fractionals is debatable even to them, most see it as a stepping stone) everyone knows you're only sticking around for a couple years.

     We had a real shakeup in 2021 because they were desperate, and the boomers are retiring in a wave that will keep riding for the next 12 years. We're on track to shrink about 30-40% as we are, barely even with putting out new ATPs against retirements. BUT the industry doesn't seem to care much, I foresee "automation" granting single pilot airline ops in the coming years. People will give in when flight numbers drop by a third for good.

     I have a buddy who told me "nobody stays in this part of the industry if they aren't a fuckup, that's why I'm still here" and it's been more true than I wanted to believe. Some guys want to be home more, afraid to leave the wife alone, get comfy at their job, but knowingly take a big monetary hit over the life of their career. Everyone's in a rush to get at their last job to build seniority so they can live on easy street

   • Ame (americanchampion@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 08:41:07 JST Ame

     in reply to

     • d
     • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks
     @WashedOutGundamPilot @monsterislandcolonizer @deprecated_ii Are the hours incredibly low, or is it just a really sketchy operator? From what I've heard from pilots I'd trust, reliable ones go for quite a bit nowadays - the last few capable old White guys are making more than I do right up until retirement, and years of kids being told not to go into the career because the oversaturation has led to overwork and bad pay has caused a meaningful shortage.
   • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks (washedoutgundampilot@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 08:50:44 JST Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks

     in reply to

     • d
     • Ame

     @AmericanChampion @monsterislandcolonizer @deprecated_ii It's actually a great time to get in. Everyone likes flying with a cool white guy, and the carriers have a hard legal retirement cap at 65. That cuts both ways, because they cannibalize the younger inexperienced jobs for fun once they're out, but it does at least keep things moving upward. It's fun, engaging, and you don't carry much baggage from one trip to another, which is great.

     The industry has coasted on its prodigious output of cold war military aviators. That supply has been drying up as GWOT wound down, and most of our numbers in the states include foreign students getting rated here. So in the end there's space to advance, and enough work on the fringe you can live any kind of life you want.

     Downsides are the difficulty of finding a good wife to stick out the lifestyle without cheating/whining/being a basket case and finding the money to slog through the early experience building phase

   • Hollyjollytailspike (monsterislandcolonizer@poa.st)'s status on Wednesday, 19-Jun-2024 10:52:27 JST Hollyjollytailspike

     in reply to

     • d
     • Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks
     @WashedOutGundamPilot @deprecated_ii It was nontaxable for the first year we received it and after that the company raised your per diem to offset the taxes.
     I was making $20 an hour putting $1200 a week into the bank, because of per diem.
     
     IOW we cared because it was an extra $1300 tax free each month.
     Woggy's Zeonic Frolicks likes this.