@freemo
Oh, there are plenty of countries like that. I believe you are in one right now. Didn’t bring a gun with you, did you? @thatguyoverthere @mike805 @lmrocha
Notices by PJ (pj@qoto.org), page 2
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 05:38:55 JST PJ -
PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 05:24:30 JST PJ Yes. That would be a good start. My suggestion was though to try seeing things from a larger perspective.
I believe that one of the problems is that too many individuals are #alienated from their immediate local (physical) #community while fulfilling their "communal needs" primarily with strangers over the Internet except for #Work and maybe #Church, which is obviously not enough, and sometimes even adds to further alienation.
I think people should be free (or even encouraged) to form their own local societies with real people they get to know because of things they feel strongly about, and guns seemed like one such catalyst to increase the number of "good guys" and minimize the harm done by "bad guys" with guns.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 05:23:56 JST PJ @freemo
The problem is that you don't need a gun shop to buy a gun or the shop doesn't care who they sell their guns to.This is the same as if you could access the internet from your computer without an ISP. Imagine what a shitshow the Internet would be then compared to what it is already is now.
If you could only buy a gun from a gun shop, I believe more than half of all the problems we have now with gun violence would go away.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 05:23:53 JST PJ @freemo @thatguyoverthere @mike805 @lmrocha
One more thought about the analogy between ISPs and gun clubs with regard to privacy, and then I'll shut up.
Long ago, I received a letter from my ISP that they got a request from an entertainment company to get my ID because they want to sue me for downloading one of their pirated series from somewhere (which I did). They were just informing me of that fact and that they won't comply with the request if I stopped.
Well, I'm not downloading anymore (streaming is better) and even if I moved a couple of times, I'm still with the same ISP.
So being a member of a good club (who knows who you are) sometimes also means you can protect your #privacy better.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 05:23:51 JST PJ No worries. The “shut up” part was a figure of speech😀. Many tried, unsuccessfully.
“legal requirement” vs. “strong suggestion”? I can work with that as long as it minimizes the chances of “bad guys” legally getting their hands on guns (e.g. more than a dozen AR-15s)
Specifically:
1) Not if being part of a club, who is a member of the NRA means you are more protected than as an isolated individual.
2) If you need to arm the victim to protect themselves from being raped by someone they have a restraining order on, that order and the agency that issued it is worth as much as the paper the order is written on.
3) See 1)
@thatguyoverthere @mike805 @lmrocha -
PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 05:23:44 JST PJ Yes. That’s exactly my point.
You should be, as an individual, protected from being killed, raped, or prevented to use a gun for legitimate reasons, but in this imperfect world you are not, so joining a group or club or some other kind of people’s #system gives you more protection than if you are facing all of that alone. In some way, these community-sanctioned associations can become a replacement for gangs.
I think this applies to 2) as well. Instead of just shoving a gun into the victim’s hands and calling it done, set up a women’s shelter or some other safe community place they can use, or get a GPS tracker on the bozo. Yes, it will violate his human rights and hurt his feelings, but who cares.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 02:15:41 JST PJ No, but your ISP always knows who you are.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 02:15:29 JST PJ @thatguyoverthere
Attacking a person is in this analogy akin to physically harming a child as opposed to "just" downloading child porn.Ideally, you would want to prevent evil or sick people to harm anyone.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 02:12:59 JST PJ Yes. you can do it all by yourself, but you need an ISP to access the Net, don't you?
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 00:45:02 JST PJ Oh, it can.
Try downloading child porn or other shit and look how fast it will be denied. -
PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 00:40:12 JST PJ @thatguyoverthere @mike805 @freemo @lmrocha
If it helps, think of it as a “gun owners’ fediverse” where each club is an “instance” and the NRA, instead of an association of individuals, is a federation of all the gun clubs of America.
Then, instead of taking care primarily of just the needs of their wealthy donors (gun manufacturers), they may start also thinking about the needs of all of their other members and their local societies. -
PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 00:40:10 JST PJ How don’t you see it is the same situation?
I can get access to the Internet from a library or walk onto a shooting range and shoot a few rounds under supervision, but if I want to buy a gun and take it home where there is a risk of harming other people, I have to get an IP subscription and join some of the social platforms where I can “shoot” nonsense like this.😀
@thatguyoverthere @mike805 @lmrocha -
PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Monday, 10-Apr-2023 00:00:26 JST PJ Why is it more terrifying than being all by yourself? Just make sure your club is not hostile to the government.😀
If the government thinks you, or any bunch you are currently associated with, are hostile, you will be stripped of your rights anyway, club or not club. At least in a club that was previously sanctioned by that same government, you have some kind of protection.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Sunday, 09-Apr-2023 23:36:24 JST PJ I might have a suggestion that could satisfy most of the people here:
Problem: The perpetrators in mass shootings are mainly “loners” with some unresolved issues.
Solution: To be able to legally buy a gun you need to be a member in good standing and have a permit from a “well-regulated militia” (a.k.a. a gun club or society).
So the responsibility for the security of a society is neither on the individual nor on the government, but on the society itself.
What do you think? Is everybody happy? You have your guns (as many as you wish) and the rest of us are a little bit less concerned we’ll get shot at our place of work, learning, or praying.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Saturday, 08-Apr-2023 01:48:18 JST PJ @thatguyoverthere
You had to "drag me back in"😀In my opinion if you have to use guns to solve anything (even in case of the police) it means we as a society suck.
@freemo's argument that women use guns to protect themselves from bad penises is also dubious. I think taking a self-defense training or even a bear spray would be much more effective.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Saturday, 08-Apr-2023 01:10:11 JST PJ Again. It is not about how you define "people". It is about having #criteria on who can and who cannot have a gun, drive a car or buy cigarettes or alcohol ...
The founding fathers had such criteria, as ***everyone could not bear a gun***, and we should also have them.
That's all I have to say.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Saturday, 08-Apr-2023 01:06:13 JST PJ You've said it is not the gun that is a problem, it is the person, and I agreed with that.
I just don't agree that we all should have to protect ourselves (supposedly with more guns) from bad persons with guns, instead of, as a civilized society, minimizing the chances these people can do harm.
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Saturday, 08-Apr-2023 00:51:57 JST PJ @thatguyoverthere
No. Are you?
@mike805 @freemo @lmrocha -
PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Saturday, 08-Apr-2023 00:48:05 JST PJ Or what? You'll shoot me?
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PJ (pj@qoto.org)'s status on Saturday, 08-Apr-2023 00:43:44 JST PJ I believe the definition of "people" at that time, as @lmrocha pointed out, might have been very narrow.