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the eternal yugicuck defending broken cards because "you can put 3 unsearchable cards that are bricks against anything else in your deck and maybe draw them to counter it"
glad i stopped playing this shit
- Machismo repeated this.
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It really is the most broken card game ever invented lol. If you play online everyone has a retarded 50-100 move turn that OTKs and counters everything. No one builds their own deck anymore they just google OP decks and memorize the strats. They need to ban all cards released from Synchro summoning until now and unban all the cards released before that.
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@Fash-E generic broken cards like baronne de fleur or zeus shouldn't exist but they will never ban them
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They shit up magic entirely with muh mixxed race.....uhhhh color decks
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@Fash-E @zero I mean half the shit in YGO could just be fixed by having a rotation.
It's not good for players but it is good for game sanity.
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@Boomerman @zero Honestly magic is cucked from the outset because of lands.
Dragonball game just has it that each turn you place one of your cards upside down in the energy zone to indicate it's an energy-producer; it adds one energy of its colour. Manascrew/flood is literally impossible unless you fuck up your colour balance in a very specific way.
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Yugioh was literally a shitty simplified mix of two early card games further simplified for the plot of a cool children's manga that got turned into a real game only popular despite the god awful rule set and card design. It's like how pokemon is still popular despite the games sucking. The fantasy is stronger than the actual game and it shows culturally.
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See the JP card game addresses this by just making even more broken cards so the previous broken cards we okay by comparison.
I like that better than being a ban cuck
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@fishsticks the actual gameplay is actually pretty unique and fun compared to other card games i tried, but it doesn't do any format rotations, every card that's ever printed and not banned is playable and they make and let extremely broken cards live for months to sell packs, and some old cards that are broken as shit never get hit either even though everyone and their grandma know they're bad
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Well the issue is that yugioh fundamentally is a bandaid game. It wasn't designed as a real game to be played in real life. Bandaid solutions are applied constantly until you get what we have now. I genuinely don't understand why they don't do format rotations and just keep the current format with the crazy ban list as a secondary format as people clearly don't like it. It's one thing if you're a new game and scared of rotations (rotations usually kill games that aren't heavily prepared for it) but I seriously doubt it would hurt yugioh.
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@zero @fishsticks There isn't another TCG like Yugioh in all the ways it's good and bad. Everything is held together precariously by most cards only being allowed to use their effects once per turn and it results in really explosive games that revolve around someone building a board of interactions and their opponent trying to maneuver around them to win.
Konami is on crack with their banlists and new card releases though. All 3 of the main ones have some cards that absolutely deserve to be banned that aren't.
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@supersid333 @zero @fishsticks have a friend who spent $500 on a deck only for half of it to become illegal the week after he bought it
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Yugioh's been trash ever since they nerfed Darkness Approaches, the most based card in the entire game.
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I always thought that Yugioh would be super popular among lawyers for those reasons.
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@Elliptica @fishsticks @zero Did you know that cards function entirely differently in niche circumstances depending on whether the condition for their effect starts with an If or a When?
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@supersid333 @Elliptica @fishsticks @zero OH boy
I sure love me some effect lawyering
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I wonder if you could use an AI to find novel broken combinations using cards that haven't been banned yet. Sort of like what they do to find molecules for new cancer drugs, but actually useful.
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@Elliptica @fishsticks @zero This is actually not a joke. So I understand it was a ruling put in place to stop a proto FTK between a card that can send equip cards to do damage to the enemy and a monster that can equip itself to a monster as an equip card when it's sent to GY.
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Really?
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@Fash-E @zero at least Magic: The Gather is Turing complete
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AI just 'guesses' as to what it needs to put as the next word, there's not any real computation or anything. you could have the same effect of assigning every card a number and using a random number generator.
maybe a model trained entirely on Yu-Gi-Oh discourse would be different
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@zero that faggot that keeps crying about maxx c not being banned in MD so he can go off with ED summon loops likes to use the same retort against things that can be used on him crying.
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@zero instead they cry about cards like shifter not being banned. I’m convinced the average yugioh player is some kind of redditoid midwit that hates interaction more than magic players and wouldn’t play without powerful generic ED monsters locking games.
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@lich it should be banned maybe but not before the tens of generic broken ed monsters every deck can shit ou
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Coming from MTG when I found out there's not rotation it blew my mind.
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@Edge @fishsticks @zero Yugioh's at it's most fun when you're playing fan formats tbh. Once the people balancing the banlists aren't biased by selling product, you get less cringe formats.
Though Trinity is fucking cringe.
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@supersid333 @zero @fishsticks
While yes, the typical MTGroid criticism that the game has some design flaws is partially true (btw it was a shounen manga, not kodomo, Yugi and Joey trade JAV tapes after all) Konami eventually figured out where to go with it after a few sets and the unique mechanics like the Extra Deck and Trap Cards got to shine. The real problems are:
a) They fell asleep at the wheel towards the end of the Pendulum era and the game got too "fast" for what the mechanics can even handle. Decks do too much turn 1 and then other decks HAVE to be hyper consistent and HAVE to spend all of their resources turn 1 to stand a chance which not only leads to the degenerate break my board games, but also very same-y games as well.
b) There's no real comeback mechanic. While Gorz helped with this for a long time, he and his ilk simply aren't enough to deal with an established board if you openly poorly and get your board broken. Most decks simply do not have enough gas left in the tank to get over multiple disruptions twice. I shouldn't have to tell you why this leads to less interesting games.
Still, I'd say the game had some good formats even into early Pendulum era, and the problem is NOT any given summoning mechanic (except Link Monsters kinda).
Thank you for coming to my tedtalk.
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@justnormalkorean @fishsticks @zero Also reminder that mtg casual is never standard anymore, it's pretty much all commander which has no rotation. :^)
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@zero @fishsticks @justnormalkorean Also
Don't suppose anyone has bofuri WS cards they're willing to sell?
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To be fair, there's kind of a rotation when newer cards power creep older ones out of your 4 of slot. EDH power creep is real, but table politics at least keeps it in check.
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i don't play nip cards games sadly.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks Eh? Don't you play YGO?
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I did when I was in school but only played once and didn't know the rules. Otherwise I collected them for like a year or 2 and watched the show up until after the battle city arc.
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oh and I played Duel Links for like an hour. There was a fun dragon synchro deck they start you off with.
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Is Master Duel a good starting placed then?
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero
Duel Links became a fucking job after a while...which is a shame as the unique format was a good idea and all of the music and other assets were pretty nice.
The skills could have been interesting too had they not been "Make your starting hand more consistent" or "Just have a free Shooting Quasar Dragon".
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tbh I was probably only going to do the campaign and play with friends if at all.
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero
Yes, BUT, you need to realize the modern game is very different than what you're probably used to. You also need to learn how to spend your gems. The game is extremely generous IF you avoid a couple newb traps. Here's a slightly NSFW starting guide from 4chan. I recommend playing through a good portion of the Solo mode first just to get a feel for different deck types (and free gems and cards).
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I'll let ya know. Kinda zonked out on card games rn with how much product Wizards has been pumping out for Magic lately. Really need to update some of my decks.
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero
Well, try out the campaign and see how you like it. If you want I'll add you and we can duel with whatever card-pool you want.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge Just get into WS instead.
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idk what that even is lol
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge Weiss Schwarz. Bushiroad's anime vs anime simulator.
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dude it's so bad.
There's a Doctor Who set coming. The Stranger Things mini set was fucking retarded. The only one that wasn't in theme with fantasy that I dug was the Street Fighter one and that's pushing it.
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero
Yeah I've heard about that, also a million crossover sets as well.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge Wasn't there already a Doctor Who set?
Also fuck crossover shit. I'll begrudgingly accept D&D because it's owned by the same people, the rest can fuck right off, especially 40k. They could have done WHF instead but nooooooooooo
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Looks dangerous to my wallet. Might just check out the art.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge I mean >TCGs
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If there was I wasn't paying attention to when it released.
The D&D one was fine because of that reason and it's also fantasy so a lot of the mechanics made sense besides I guess dice rolling.
40k if they got their own game with the same rules I could have lived with. But to cross them into the same game is fucking retarded. They tried to soften the blow with a set prior that release by making it a gangster themed one with magic guns so people wouldn't have a nerd fit when it finally hit the shelves.
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This is why I've subjected myself to playing exclusively Magic Duels without putting in money for gems and Cockatrice to play people ik online.
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It's so fucking gay
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero
Doctor Who? Man...
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge >a lot of the mechanics made sense besides I guess dice rolling.
The fucking party mechanic was dumb as shit, because half the cards using it were about counting the size of the party, but then it was limited to 4. To begin with, every class should be a valid party target (or at least a few more like berserker), also it would have been better if it only counted when you had exactly one of them.
And probably something about you getting extra abilities just for having party slots filled.
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@Edge @Zerglingman @fishsticks @justnormalkorean @zero Magic likes reinventing the wheel for standard format.
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@Zerglingman @fishsticks @justnormalkorean @zero
Wait, didn't Magic already have a mechanic where you can "party" creatures together?
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@Edge @justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero I think the thing I dislike about Duel Links is that the skills encourage you to only play anime decks, and that any time skills get used in ways that the designers didn't expect they get nerfed with restrictions so you can only use them the way they want you to.
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@Edge @justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @fishsticks @zero I'm always down to show the ropes in Yugioh. I know I taught a friend by giving him easy decks and running a GX-era game NPC deck against him until he was comfortable enough to beat beater with equip spells pass. He then proceeded to learn how to play monkey flip trap decks lol.
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Banding is gay and even judges don't know how to enforce it.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge Banding in MtG? As in "when a creature with banding and another creature block the same creature, the defending player assigns the attacking creature's combat damage"?
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Yeah, it's supposed to role swap which player assigns combat damage I guess, but things get super hairy rules wise.
On paper it's simple, but once you introduce layers things get all fucked.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge ... How?
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I don't know exactly because judges don't even know how to make a call on it. Wizards has effectively not given a shit about the mechanic since it rotated out and won't update the rules to agree with the current ruleset. Basically since they kept updating the rules to be at least 20 times as complicated since banding was introduced, there's no actual way for two creatures to be recognized as one while assigning combat damage.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge It doesn't do that though? It just lets the defending player allocate the damage.
Though I should check if it's still the case that you have to assign enough damage to kill one creature before assigning to another, since that would make banding less useful.
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It's not supposed to do that, but due to how the rules dictate damage being assigned they're effectively 1 creature rules wise.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge What. That sounds wrong from the outset?
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Look. From what I've seen and heard about banding literally nobody actually knows how the mechanic actually works so you guess is as good as mine. Like sure the mechanic says one thing, but Magic rules have changed so much since the 90s that it's going to be hard to keep it in line with current day rules unless they completely change how it works like what they did to Madness.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge It seems very straightforward and obvious to me though. As in "there are no possible complexities involved except those that are inherent to assigning combat damage".
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I'm pretty sure the main problem is because the attacking player assigns combat damage that it fucks with the layers rules in some way or another that makes judges blow their brains out. Literally nobody runs banding anyways because it's actually a bad mechanic in how it was supposed to work and how I guess judges just pull out of their asses. Unless it's some meme deck that's trolling.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge I agree that banding is shit, although I like the intention.
Actually you could cut out the part about blocking with another creature and just say "when this creature blocks, you assign the blocked creature's combat damage". If it blocks alone, you can assign it, but there's only one valid way to assign it anyway, with or without tromple.
But how the fuck do layers have anything to do with it wtf, I think I need to go look this up, this sounds like "experts" being retarded again.
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Dude idfk. I don't use the mechanic, and I've never come across it. Somebody needs to make one of those informative videos on it lol.
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge >videos
gross
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I'm watching a video on Minecraft's new ToS rn lol
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@justnormalkorean @zero @fishsticks @Edge Why would you do that to yourself? You know exactly what it's going to be: Leftist bullshit.
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If you rack up enough gold for dailies you can save that and draft in MTG Arena.
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @Edge @fishsticks @zero I gave up on that game years ago because it just felt like they were milking for money. I'd rather an online game where everything is free with draft style play. paying to collect things feels bad
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AntVenom is actually fairly disagreeable with the updated terms. He is sponsored by Soylet though lol
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Sounds dope. If I get around to it I wanna at least familiarize myself with the rules again and at least finish the campaign for Duels first.
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @Edge @fishsticks if you're gonna just play with friends just use ygo omega, you don't have to pull/craft the cards there
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@justnormalkorean @Zerglingman @Edge @fishsticks @zero I like EDOpro over Omega but yeah, learning the game on the fan sims are probably a better idea. Can even wheen you in on formats with less cards or something like that Draft Cube Edge wants to run.
Zero :zt_think: :artix:
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