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1. :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins (jyushimatsu@varishangout.net)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 01:48:15 JST :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins
   love working on something with other people and 2 out of 4 of us are dead weight
   like they have the easiest job of literally writing/ideas guy(i think) and they dont even do that
   and then im spending my time picking up after them like suddenly im the whole dev team now
   solodev is the only way indie projects get done dont fall for team nonsense...
   • xianc78 repeated this.
   • :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins (jyushimatsu@varishangout.net)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 01:48:12 JST :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker
     @PurpCat
     i dont quite get even the e-celeb appeal of being a kuso indie dev but maybe thats because i personally think of like phil fish or whatever his name was first and go "why does anyone want to be like him?"
     
     the ones that get caught in the game engine autism always get me
     like they actually are talented and have motivation, you could probably have them working at a AAA game company but their brain worms are intense and you can't convince them to do something else
     wasted potential
     
     also i hope you do eventually get to learn c# and art but without losing your source of income 🙏
     xianc78 likes this.
   • Pawlicker (purpcat@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 01:48:13 JST Pawlicker

     in reply to
     @jyushimatsu here in my case it's less laziness and more IRL stress of a really, really, shit job. I already have plans where if something happens to my job I'm going to just finally start learning C# and art and whatnot in between jobs.
     
     >im not even sure what clout they're expecting?
     
     I'd argue what happened with Notch during his e-celeb phase where he made one hit and faded out and some other other has-beens of the past is what they want, because if you have one project to your name people will take you seriously in online arguments and similar.
     
     I agree on the fantasy part, IMO to nerds being a gamedev is like how everyone in high school wanted to be a sportsball athlete or WWE star or some shit and then when that falls through they ended up at the desk job or working behind the counter at a Bally Fitness location (real, saw it once).
     
     Many burnouts I knew online were like this, they wanted to make a game but either didn't have a drive to do it, or got caught up in some autism like "I need to write an engine from scratch for something that could be done in Game Maker/Multimedia Fusion" and burning out as a result.
     
     IMO, wanting to do gamedev isn't for everyone. It's like how being an online artist clearly isn't for everyone.
   • Pawlicker (purpcat@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 01:48:14 JST Pawlicker

     in reply to
     @jyushimatsu learned that when I was in a bad spot in life and I wanted to make a game and the other guy who was gonna help was in college eternally and the other was just a lazy NEET and then both had falling outs with me after a year or two (dodged a bullet).
     
     I'm sure it attracts a lot of people who want to say they worked on an indie game and do nothing, ever seen the credits for AAA games where the legal department and HR team are on it?
     xianc78 likes this.
   • :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins (jyushimatsu@varishangout.net)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 01:48:14 JST :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker
     @PurpCat
     you're much smarter lol i still want to try to finish at least one game as a part of a group 🤡 even a neet could still finish something if they weren't lazy though...
     
     and yeah i figure most people who want to work in indie dev just do it for clout. im not even sure what clout they're expecting? even normal people don't respect HR for example lmao
     its like they have this fantasy in their head of what gamedev should be (erping on discord and telling everyone you make $6900 making roblox games i guess) and drag everyone down with them
   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 01:57:05 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     @PurpCat @jyushimatsu I think gamedev is something you need to start when you are really young and still have a lot of free-time. You also need to be a rare, patient child who realizes that you aren't going to start by making 3D first-person shooters with online multiplayer. The problem is that most kids aren't willing to learn how to program and can't convince their parents to buy something like the full version of GameMaker for them. I messed with GameMaker Lite as a kid, but I was spoiled and wanted to make 3D games which was only available if you paid $50 for the pro version, and I was too stupid to pirate software back then.

     By the time I was in high school and knew how to program graphics using Pygame, I was involved with so many extra-circular activities that I was easily burnt out when I got home.

   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 02:16:51 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     @jyushimatsu @PurpCat
     >the ones that get caught in the game engine autism always get me
     like they actually are talented and have motivation, you could probably have them working at a AAA game company but their brain worms are intense and you can't convince them to do something else
     wasted potential

     Not much anymore, sadly. The internally developed game engine is pretty much dead at this point. Even some subsidiaries at Nintendo are using Unity or Unreal for some games. I wish they would at least compromise and use frameworks like MonoGame or OGRE instead, but I guess it's better for them to use full-blown engines as it makes it easier to reuse assets between games.

   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 02:45:07 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     @jyushimatsu @PurpCat
     >unless they wanted to make an engine for anyone else to use, but i don't see that quite often either it's usually just personal use and then they die

     People who write their own engines do so either because they don't want their game to have that samey feel that most games using the same engine have, they want to target older/more obscure platforms, or don't like how bloated most modern engines are. As for allowing others to use their engines, there have been successful and popular engines that were originally used for indie games. Godot comes to mind.

   • :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins (jyushimatsu@varishangout.net)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 02:45:08 JST :teto_fumo: ジュース :teto: now neither of us will be virgins

     in reply to

     • xianc78
     • Pawlicker
     @xianc78 @PurpCat ah yeah that's also true regarding game engines used in industry (i should remember because for some reason unreal games make my switch a toaster), point still stands they're fumbling about instead of trying to make a game
     unless they wanted to make an engine for anyone else to use, but i don't see that quite often either it's usually just personal use and then they die
   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 03:43:29 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     @PurpCat @jyushimatsu I honestly wouldn't recommend targeting obscure platforms unless you are really experienced at creating games. Community is a really important factor when choosing a language, framework, engine, platform, etc.

   • Pawlicker (purpcat@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 03:43:30 JST Pawlicker

     in reply to

     • xianc78
     @xianc78 @jyushimatsu if I ever write PC98 homebrew I'm going to make the source code open to kickstart more gamedevs IMO, just so they have some code to look at to understand the machine (given all the docs are in Japanese).
   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 03:58:43 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     @PurpCat @jyushimatsu Just use N88-BASIC it's just essentially Microsoft BASIC, even down to having the same graphic APIs.

   • Pawlicker (purpcat@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 03:58:44 JST Pawlicker

     in reply to

     • xianc78
     @xianc78 @jyushimatsu yeah it's not the first time for sure doing anything.
     PC-98 dev at least is just MS-DOS dev on bath salts.
   • Pawlicker (purpcat@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 11:55:52 JST Pawlicker

     in reply to

     • gentoobro
     @gentoobro @jyushimatsu I read about a Japanese developer making an ambitious sci-fi strategy game in the 80s for 5 fucking platforms at once (DAIVA) and by ambitious I mean it was planned to be released on 7 platforms at once, with each part of the story on a different platform and each part having it's own platforming segment by another dev designed to take advantage of each platform.
     
     Then near the end he didn't just pass out, he ended up temporarily blind. So part 7 of the game felt entirely different (part 6 was done by a different dev entirely) because it was literally written by another guy because he was burnt out from writing machine code in 2 different CPU arches for 5 machines at once.
   • gentoobro (gentoobro@shitpost.cloud)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 11:55:53 JST gentoobro

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     I once worked in the same building as and befriended an ex-Valve engine dev. A guy's whose name is semi-famous. He nearly died from the stress of the job. Everything you hear about shit working conditions is true and likely understated. You really don't want to work in AAA, and if you have the skills to do so you have the skills to make indie games on your own.

   • gentoobro (gentoobro@shitpost.cloud)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 11:55:54 JST gentoobro

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     working at a AAA

     I don't want to deal with pinhead managers, bitch HR cunts, or mandatory 60 hour weeks. I've met other devs much better than me who share the sentiment.

   • Pawlicker (purpcat@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 11:55:54 JST Pawlicker

     in reply to

     • gentoobro
     @gentoobro @jyushimatsu All I know about "working in AAA" could be summed up with the story of /u/callofnobodycares.
     
     https://web.archive.org/web/20181110202006/https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/9vvjmb/fired_from_3arc_zombies_ee_team_today_ask_me/
     
     The tl;dr: he was sleeping in his car for a chance to work at the company he idolized only to discover it's a literal sweatshop/wagecage. When Kotaku did their Treyarch working conditions article, he would eventually on Reddit say "yeah it's real/lines up".
     
     I've heard other stories about it, both the infamous crunch culture and also a skilled contractor with a resume getting kicked out by security after blowing up at being offered $15 an hour (and this IIRC was pre-bidenomics).
   • gentoobro (gentoobro@shitpost.cloud)'s status on Tuesday, 03-Sep-2024 11:56:20 JST gentoobro

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker

     The 80's was nuts. Tons of very diverse platforms.

     Nowadays you only need to target x86-64. There's so little difference between Windows and Linux now that a properly factored game can ship on both platforms with only a tiny fraction of specialized platform code.

   • gentoobro (gentoobro@shitpost.cloud)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Sep-2024 04:13:56 JST gentoobro

     in reply to

     • xianc78
     • Pawlicker

     You definitely can't have many other hobbies alongside game dev. Playing games included.

     xianc78 likes this.
   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Wednesday, 04-Sep-2024 04:25:37 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • Pawlicker
     • gentoobro

     @gentoobro @PurpCat @jyushimatsu And that is also the problem because you need to have played a diverse library of games in order to be a good dev. Masahiro Sakurai even played the games he hated growing up just to learn what does and does not work.