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PC-9801 Enjoyer (pawlicker@bae.st)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:07:46 JST PC-9801 Enjoyer

BREAKING NEWS: EUGEN TO ADD FULL TEXT SEARCH TO MASTODON (for users who opt in btw) AND MASTODONGS ARE LITERALLY ON SUICIDE WATCH LMAOOO THIS IS GOOD
https://retro.social/@ajroach42/110859775911698406
https://archive.fo/wip/EBwZq

The commit
https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/pull/26344
image.png
In conversation about a year ago from bae.st permalink
Attachments
1. image.png
  https://bae.st/media/b46e0430d7334a8db8b8f967abb5941ff2b1f93d346c5a5c58534d22c865db3c.png?name=image.png
2. No result found on File_thumbnail lookup.
  
  Andrew (R.S Admin) (@ajroach42@retro.social)
  
  from Andrew (R.S Admin)
  
  Eugen is putting instance admins in an unreasonable situation, and I'm not thrilled with it. For the last six months, we've had m.s silenced because they couldn't moderate their servers or prevent spam and harassment. I undid that silence a few days ago, because I noticed people replying to m.s users on one of my posts, and it bothered me that there were people who were responding to what I said and I had no mechanism to view their responses, and they had no way to know I wouldn't see them. Silencing an instance is a bad half measure that does more to give the illusion of safety than to actually provide safety, and I only employed it in this case because there are enough users I interact with on m.s who are unlikely to move to another instance that I felt it was necessary not to fully break the connection. But now I'm staring down this full text search issue. I've broken ties with huge instances in the past over this exact issue, over nearly this exact implementation. But Eugen has decided that this is the standard for all mastodon instances going forward, and that puts me in a difficult spot. 1) silencing an instance does not keep my users posts out of their full text search. 2) suspended an instance does not keep 100% of my users posts out of their full text search unless I also enable authorized fetch 3) there will be no obvious way to tell, other than software version numbers, who might have full text search enabled, and even less of a way to tell which instances are likely to see it abused. Personally? I don't mind full text search. I'd probably delete some of my old posts rather than have them available for any random user to turn up at a whim and use a moment in which I was vulnerable against me, but I post publicly, under my real name, without follow requests because I sometimes use this account to draw attention to things I'm passionate about, and I'm not a likely target for abuse. But a number of the users on my small server were actively harassed off of Twitter through abuse facilitated by full text search, and a large proportion of my users are members of communities that are often targeted in this way, and I owe it to them to do whatever I can to protect them. And, as demonstrated above, silencing or limiting instances with full text search isn't helpful, it has to be full suspension. (And this is being made the default across new installs and upgrades for the most common software package on the fediverse. Suspending the majority of other instances does not really sound like an option. It seems unlikely that there's a good solution here, so long as Eugen continues down this path. Toothpaste doesn't go back in to the tube. The djinn doesn't go back in the bottle. You can't wake up if you don't fall asleep.) So ... what the hell should we, as instance admins, do in the face of this?
3. Untitled attachment
4. Add new public status index by jsgoldstein · Pull Request #26344 · mastodon/mastodon
  
  This is a follow up to #25951 The idea here is to allow public posts by discoverable users to show up in search results. This is done by adding a new Public Status Index to Elastic Search. A status...
- matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: and like this.
- PC-9801 Enjoyer (pawlicker@bae.st)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:08:27 JST PC-9801 Enjoyer
  in reply to
  @mint holy fucking shit get your popcorn this is gonna be good
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
  likes this.
- (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:11:24 JST
  in reply to
  - Himbo Techbro
  @Pawlicker Hilarious! Who's gonna tell him that:
  1. Pleroma and forks had full-text search for ages;
  2. Any instance admin can do a SELECT query on the database and get the posts regardless of whether it's supported in frontend?
  @r000t might get a few laughs as well.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
  matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
- (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:14:02 JST
  in reply to
  - Himbo Techbro
  @Pawlicker @r000t >what the hell should we, as instance admins, do in the face of this?
  Swallow up and stop blaming a basic software feature for users' bad opsec.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
- (mint@ryona.agency)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:15:29 JST
  in reply to
  - Himbo Techbro
  @r000t @Pawlicker Links:
  https://retro.social/@ajroach42/110859775911698406
  https://archive.fo/wip/EBwZq
  https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/pull/26344
  Screenshot_20230809_231422.png
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  Attachments
  1. No result found on File_thumbnail lookup.
    
    Andrew (R.S Admin) (@ajroach42@retro.social)
    
    from Andrew (R.S Admin)
    
    Eugen is putting instance admins in an unreasonable situation, and I'm not thrilled with it. For the last six months, we've had m.s silenced because they couldn't moderate their servers or prevent spam and harassment. I undid that silence a few days ago, because I noticed people replying to m.s users on one of my posts, and it bothered me that there were people who were responding to what I said and I had no mechanism to view their responses, and they had no way to know I wouldn't see them. Silencing an instance is a bad half measure that does more to give the illusion of safety than to actually provide safety, and I only employed it in this case because there are enough users I interact with on m.s who are unlikely to move to another instance that I felt it was necessary not to fully break the connection. But now I'm staring down this full text search issue. I've broken ties with huge instances in the past over this exact issue, over nearly this exact implementation. But Eugen has decided that this is the standard for all mastodon instances going forward, and that puts me in a difficult spot. 1) silencing an instance does not keep my users posts out of their full text search. 2) suspended an instance does not keep 100% of my users posts out of their full text search unless I also enable authorized fetch 3) there will be no obvious way to tell, other than software version numbers, who might have full text search enabled, and even less of a way to tell which instances are likely to see it abused. Personally? I don't mind full text search. I'd probably delete some of my old posts rather than have them available for any random user to turn up at a whim and use a moment in which I was vulnerable against me, but I post publicly, under my real name, without follow requests because I sometimes use this account to draw attention to things I'm passionate about, and I'm not a likely target for abuse. But a number of the users on my small server were actively harassed off of Twitter through abuse facilitated by full text search, and a large proportion of my users are members of communities that are often targeted in this way, and I owe it to them to do whatever I can to protect them. And, as demonstrated above, silencing or limiting instances with full text search isn't helpful, it has to be full suspension. (And this is being made the default across new installs and upgrades for the most common software package on the fediverse. Suspending the majority of other instances does not really sound like an option. It seems unlikely that there's a good solution here, so long as Eugen continues down this path. Toothpaste doesn't go back in to the tube. The djinn doesn't go back in the bottle. You can't wake up if you don't fall asleep.) So ... what the hell should we, as instance admins, do in the face of this?
  2. Untitled attachment
  3. Add new public status index by jsgoldstein · Pull Request #26344 · mastodon/mastodon
    
    This is a follow up to #25951 The idea here is to allow public posts by discoverable users to show up in search results. This is done by adding a new Public Status Index to Elastic Search. A status...
  4. Screenshot_20230809_231422.png
    https://ryona.agency/media/8da3e70687877c9e39a8160042fd7407f47f0ddd9b417a8d76cbdc834faf26b4.png?name=Screenshot_20230809_231422.png
- Himbo Techbro (r000t@ligma.pro)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:15:40 JST Himbo Techbro
  in reply to
  @mint @Pawlicker I can't see what's being referenced.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
- PC-9801 Enjoyer (pawlicker@bae.st)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:16:20 JST PC-9801 Enjoyer
  in reply to
  - Himbo Techbro
  @mint @r000t Oh he knows about it, it's why he is paranoid as fuck about blocking people since he's worried about "federating bad actors for my own safety"
  image.png
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  Attachments
  1. image.png
    https://bae.st/media/500958fbf44611b3ad5d01cafb4273646b45763132969774ac7ab0fed7105c09.png?name=image.png
  likes this.
- Anatoly Korenchkin (akorenchkin@clubcyberia.co)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:17:39 JST Anatoly Korenchkin
  in reply to
  - bot :kiwi_dumbbell:
  - Lina Inver:z:e :mur_close: :nuts:
  @bot @Pawlicker @lina Because someone might search for words like--and this a COMPLETE stab in the dark here--words like "egg" and "minor".
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
  likes this.
- PC-9801 Enjoyer (pawlicker@bae.st)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:17:40 JST PC-9801 Enjoyer
  in reply to
  - Lina Inver:z:e :mur_close: :nuts:
  @lina Probably making some crackhead fork that has features removed for "safety" because goddamn bluesky has search since everyone who is pissed off is a delusional piece of shit who don't realize that it won't let you search non indexable users.
  image.png
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
- bot :kiwi_dumbbell: (bot@seal.cafe)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:17:40 JST bot :kiwi_dumbbell:
  in reply to
  - Lina Inver:z:e :mur_close: :nuts:
  I don’t understand why they’re so terrified of search.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
- Lina Inver:z:e :mur_close: :nuts: (lina@eientei.org)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:17:42 JST Lina Inver:z:e :mur_close: :nuts:
  in reply to
  
  @Pawlicker so where to are they going? back to twitter?
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
- Himbo Techbro (r000t@ligma.pro)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:22:05 JST Himbo Techbro
  in reply to
  @mint @Pawlicker I am not allowed to make comments on this sort of thing anymore.
  What I will say is that people understanding that public things may be indexed is a universal good for their health and safety. This is because the inverse, telling them that their posts definitely can never ever be indexed, gives them a false sense of security, causing them to post publicly things they may not want searchable.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
  likes this.
- PurpCat (V2) (need more art) (purpcat@marsey.moe)'s status on Thursday, 10-Aug-2023 05:25:02 JST PurpCat (V2) (need more art)
  in reply to
  - Himbo Techbro
  I like to call this problem "privacy through obscurity". Nobody on the fedi believes that anything they post can stay up forever, they are under the illusion that it gives them even more control over their online persona than Twitter does.
  
  Unfortunately that could not only not be further from the truth, but it's a dangerous mindset on the level of "I got my name out of the phonebook or listed it under an alias, I'm impossible to harass".
  
  To these people, this very instance and any running Pleroma/Misskey could be an archiver too.
  
  In conversation about a year ago permalink
  
  likes this.

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