Conversation

Notices

1. matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: (matrix@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:01:20 JST matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire:

   What the fuck? Why? Why did they think it was a loosing? Clean room emulators are legal. Did Yuzu have some code from leaks in it?

   • matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: (matrix@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:08:37 JST matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire:

     in reply to

     • Richard (Dick) Johnson

     @RichardJohnson I would assume if they have the money for a settlement they probably have money for lawyers

   • Richard (Dick) Johnson (richardjohnson@noauthority.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:08:38 JST Richard (Dick) Johnson

     in reply to

     @matrix

     Because, in America, you can sue anyone for anything.

     And Nintendo has more money than the Yuzu devs. So, even if they don't win, they will make life very difficult for them.

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • xianc78@gameliberty.club's status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:14:01 JST xianc78

     in reply to

     • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:

     @galena @matrix
     >patreon was also a large part of the issue

     There is nothing illegal about making money off of emulators. There were tons of shareware emulators back in the 90s and early 2000s.

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket: (galena@paws.moe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:14:02 JST 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:

     in reply to
     @matrix Yuzu apparently wasn't clean room, and patreon was also a large part of the issue. From what I've heard, the devs were openly talking about playing leaked games early, which breaks the whole "no I was totally playing backups of games I legally purchased and dumped myself" thing all of the emulator devs need to pretend to do.
     
     Plus, it's the US. Even if they were 100% innocent and Nintendo had absolutely 0 case whatsoever, Nintendo is a multibillion dollar company, and Yuzu is a small business. Nintendo can afford to drag out a frivolous lawsuit that has 0 chance of going anywhere for decades to bleed them dry, and Yuzu absolutely can not afford to fight that battle in court. It's why so many lawsuits involving these huge corporations are settled out of court - saying "Okay I admit I was wrong" and going bankrupt because you can't afford to pay a few million dollars is a hell of a lot better than battling it for years, going bankrupt, and then declared guilty because you ran out of money, which leads to you getting a fine 100x as large (which you still can't pay), and setting a precedent that emulators are illegal leading to every other emulator that's ever existed getting taken down.
     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • :meru_B: b e a r d (beardalaxy@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:16:54 JST :meru_B: b e a r d

     in reply to

     @matrix ooooffff

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • :meru_B: b e a r d (beardalaxy@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 05:21:58 JST :meru_B: b e a r d

     in reply to

     • xianc78
     • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:

     @xianc78 @galena @matrix it also was clean room. They "stole" code from Ryujinx, allegedly. Patreon was only for new builds, otherwise you could build it yourself for free. I have seen nothing that alludes to them making patches for unreleased games, they have always claimed otherwise. TotK had updates only when it released.

     Regardless none of that was what was actually in the suit. It was all about using keys Nintendo claimed were "illegally obtained" and yuzu telling people how to get those keys (ripping them from your own switch).

     xianc78 likes this.
   • shitposter mongoliensis (gd5426@bae.st)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:03:20 JST shitposter mongoliensis

     in reply to
     @matrix I think it's more a case of the emu devs not wanting to fight a legal battle for years and go broke from the cost.
     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • Richard (Dick) Johnson (richardjohnson@noauthority.social)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:04:12 JST Richard (Dick) Johnson

     in reply to

     @matrix

     Maybe. But not as much as Nintendo.

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket: (galena@paws.moe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:05:50 JST 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:

     in reply to

     • xianc78
     @xianc78 @matrix Nothing illegal about it, but it gives the lawyers a much better case for reaming your ass in court for a few decades.
     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket: (galena@paws.moe)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:05:50 JST 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:

     in reply to

     • Richard (Dick) Johnson
     @matrix @RichardJohnson Look at what happened to Gary Bowser. He settled for $10 million he didn't have, and he's paying it to Nintendo in installments of $25 a month, on top of being sentenced to 3 years in jail.
     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • teknomunk (teknomunk@apogee.polaris-1.work)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:06:17 JST teknomunk

     in reply to

     • Richard (Dick) Johnson
     @RichardJohnson @matrix
     
     The process is the punishment.
     
     :akko_tired:
     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • teknomunk (teknomunk@apogee.polaris-1.work)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:07:15 JST teknomunk

     in reply to

     • Richard (Dick) Johnson
     @matrix @RichardJohnson
     
     Could very well be that they looked at the cost of hiring lawyers and found that $2.4 million was less than what they were being told legal fees would be if they fought.
   • Himbo Techbro (r000t@ligma.pro)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:09:02 JST Himbo Techbro

     in reply to

     • Richard (Dick) Johnson

     @RichardJohnson
     This is why one should do this sort of development anonymously.
     @matrix

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: (matrix@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 06:09:17 JST matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire:

     in reply to

     • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:

     @galena Oh, that would make their case harder although it imo doesn't prove Nintendo's claim

   • matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: (matrix@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 08:39:38 JST matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire:

     in reply to

     Fuck no, they took out Citra too

   • :meru_B: b e a r d (beardalaxy@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 10:13:01 JST :meru_B: b e a r d

     in reply to

     @matrix :pepegun:

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • Biendeo (biendeo@m.biendeo.com)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 17:37:28 JST Biendeo

     in reply to

     I don’t fully understand the laws behind everything but my interpretation is that Nintendo are leveraging the DMCA to say “extracting your own encryption keys and copying your own owned version of the software” constitutes piracy (even if you paid for your own copies and you’re using this for personal use). Yuzu explained on their documentation how to do this which therefore means they are infringing on intellectual property. Them developing software to then use this dumped data to emulate games is more icing on the cake but is a consequence of that previous point. I think the only precedent cases are ones from before the DMCA was really abused like it is (so cases like Sony v. Connectix and Sega v. Accolade).

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • :meru_B: b e a r d (beardalaxy@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 17:37:43 JST :meru_B: b e a r d

     in reply to

     • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:
     • Richard (Dick) Johnson

     @galena @matrix @RichardJohnson what happened to Gary was overkill, but Nintendo didn't decide the sentence. Gary also was legitimately providing pirated games. And team xecuter had been bricking consoles for a while. Dude got what was coming to him.

     Yuzu on the other hand did nothing wrong. They just don't want to spend the rest of their lives fighting Nintendo.

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • Julian Groß (juliangro@social.linux.pizza)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 22:01:28 JST Julian Groß

     in reply to

     @matrix they aren't actually legal either. They are pretty much just a gray area that is protected by status-quo, at least in the US. Though I would think of the same being true in many countries.
     In the US for example, there is a chance of a company like Nintendo losing such a case, which would be way worse for them than the current status-quo, which is why it took them so long to take legal action.

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: (matrix@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 22:03:45 JST matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire:

     in reply to

     • Julian Groß

     @juliangro Isn't there a precedent for clean room reverse engineering not violating copyright?

   • pomstan (pomstan@xn--p1abe3d.xn--80asehdb)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 22:09:40 JST pomstan

     in reply to

     • Julian Groß

     @matrix @juliangro tools for circumventing drm are illegal under dmca

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: (matrix@gameliberty.club)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 22:09:57 JST matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire:

     in reply to

     • pomstan
     • Julian Groß

     @pomstan @juliangro They weren't circumventing drm though

   • pomstan (pomstan@xn--p1abe3d.xn--80asehdb)'s status on Tuesday, 05-Mar-2024 22:13:16 JST pomstan

     in reply to

     • Julian Groß

     @matrix @juliangro it's up to mr. pilpulstein in the judge's chair

     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.
   • iced quinnsmas :blobcatsanta: (icedquinn@blob.cat)'s status on Sunday, 10-Mar-2024 18:44:27 JST iced quinnsmas :blobcatsanta:

     in reply to

     • 😼 Space Catboy :redrocket:
     @galena @matrix > its america
     as far as i'm aware, there are zero countries in the first world that have meaningful penalties for committing lawfare.
     matrix07012 :thotpatrol: :cunnyEmpire: likes this.