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1. jacqueline 🌟 (jacqueline@chaos.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:17 JST jacqueline 🌟

   lb people get such a bee in their bonnet about rust. just chill out. be normal.

   • Timon 🛠 (timonsku@mastodon.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:13 JST Timon 🛠

     in reply to

     @jacqueline Which I think is probably the biggest reason for the divide. I know extremely few people who regularly write both C and Rust. People are usually either Rust only or C only. So there is a divide in communities and you don't get that much exposure to practical Rust if you are not a Rust enthusiast.

   • minute (mntmn@mastodon.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:13 JST minute

     in reply to

     • Timon 🛠

     @timonsku @jacqueline i write and like both c and rust but i write a lot less rust because the mental effort and compile times are higher, and c is so simple for just quickly doing dirty stuff... actually i have someone to write most of the rust for me *ahem*

   • Timon 🛠 (timonsku@mastodon.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:14 JST Timon 🛠

     in reply to

     @jacqueline People are so weird about languages.
     Yes Rust does not seem easy to pick up but thats not the reason why I don't use it productively. If its worth the effort I'll suck it up and learn it.
     The main reason I don't use it is because C inter-op is very cumbersome.
     If I don't want a very hard life it seems either go full Rust or no Rust and I have no choice 99% of the time to have a massive amount of C code to interact with.

   • Timon 🛠 (timonsku@mastodon.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:14 JST Timon 🛠

     in reply to

     @jacqueline Which is probably the main reason why Zig kinda seems attractive from a distance. It seems to be ridiculed a lot so not sure if its a *good* language but it tackles that issue head on and would make it far easier to just start with without needing to abandon my life and become a Crustacean full time.

   • jacqueline 🌟 (jacqueline@chaos.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:15 JST jacqueline 🌟

     in reply to

     really telling tbh that almost every question is either "i don't want to learn rust" or "i don't know rust, but..."

     even if you think rust in the kernel is bad, you still have a duty to know enough about it to be able to articulate a real counterargument. throwing your hands up and yelling "i'm not learning your point of view because it sucks!" is such a childish fucken attitude.

   • jacqueline 🌟 (jacqueline@chaos.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:13:16 JST jacqueline 🌟

     in reply to

     listen to this for a few minutes; the first couple of questions after the linked timestamp. https://youtu.be/WiPp9YEBV0Q?t=1529

     it's just so embarrassing. the speaker's done some really great and valuable work, and he's got some good ideas for how to make work like this easier.

     and what does he get? a bunch of fucken losers who see an angle bracket and think "omg this is literally enterprise java!!"

     i'd quit too, man.

   • minute (mntmn@mastodon.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:19:15 JST minute

     in reply to

     • Timon 🛠

     @timonsku @jacqueline (background: we have a pretty complicated custom web app in rust running all our financial stuff, and reform-setup-wizard is rust&gtk4. our shop is rails. and i need to deal with C on a daily basis in the kernel etc. i also have a hobby DAW which is a mess of C and C++. all the languages are fun if they work!)

   • Timon 🛠 (timonsku@mastodon.social)'s status on Friday, 30-Aug-2024 08:28:32 JST Timon 🛠

     in reply to

     • minute

     @mntmn @jacqueline thats actually what I hear most of the time. If people use Rust its in a green field project thats Rust only. Which is by far the easiest place to start using it I think.
     If I think about embedded the only place where I can see me starting to use it is in projects like the Linux Kernel if that ever wins the fight or in Zephyr potentially at some point where people are less weird about third language support.