@prettygood Usually at least some aspect of orcs predecessors was corrupted and rendered as their current, lesser form. Tolkien orcs are half-digested and reconstituted Quendi. Trinimac was rather literally eaten and then shitted out as Malacath by Boethiah, with transformation reflecting in Orsimer. Draenor orcs were corrupted by Mannoroth. Krork were crushed by Necron/C'Tan and then devolved into Orkz. Orcs cannot fall. To be an orc is to be fallen, twisted and humiliated.